P38 variations (courtesy of Orv. Mauser employed a comparable serial numbering system to the one used by Walther. Serial numbers ranged from 1 to 10,000. Walther contracted production of the P-38 and later the PP series guns with the French Manurhin company. After Walther built a new plant in Ulm, all P-38 production was moved back to Germany, but Walther decided to keep having Manurhin produce the PP series pistols in France under contract.

1. Ppk Serial Number List
2. Walther P22 Serial Numbers

Hi, I possess a Vintage Walther PP 7.65md pistol that I recently purchased and I'm fascinated in learning more about it. Fróm what I'vé already been capable to get from searching this site and looking at the serial number chart this gun should end up being went out with around 1942. I noticed something unusual about the gun though in thát it doésn't display any of the engraving on the weapon glide. It is virtually unengraved in thát it doésn't also have got the walther title on it anywhere except on the plastic material grabs and on one side of the journal.

This struck me as strange because all the ones I've actually seen had something on the slip. I feel going to try to upload some pics of the gun for inspection. Any details you can give me about this piece will be greatly valued. The serial quantity can be observed on the side of the grip and on the correct aspect of the glide.

There is definitely a mark on the boIt and under thé bolt just under the ejection slot. These I think are the same, but I haven't happen to be capable to appear at them near more than enough to be sure. I feel not capable to blog post pictures right now but will add them in the morning when I obtain to my personal computer.

Thanks Ron for your analysis. I really like the weapon, it can be very limited and offers good actions.

Very very easy. I've under no circumstances seen one particular without any éngraving on it át all, therefore this would certainly explain why. For a gun being made on the way out it sure is usually a great weapon though. Sure the etched ones are usually wonderful, but this one provides alot of personality. Any various other opinions are certainly pleasant.

I will end up being posting pics soon of an older Damascus Barrel or clip estate shotgun I bought that I havén't alot óf info about. It is usually German though so it will be interesting to learn even more about it. My resources date that gun to past due 1944, therefore it had been past due, but not one of the final wartime pistols. It does, however, date to a time period when the German born military had been using all Walther PP manufacturing so the industrial marking has been dropped completely and just the Walther code 'air conditioning unit' was stamped on the slip.

Even therefore, the proof marks are commercial, not really military services, as they would be if the gun was made under a military contract instead than just bought under a purchase order. Just FWIW, the industrial Walther marks (banner ad, address-model-caIiber) on those little pistols were not placed or move placed, they were etched.

The serial number and 'ac' on the OP'beds pistol were rubber-stamped. I quit making also WAGs on beliefs of Nazi-era A language like german pistols. Every period I give a figure centered on what I find at gun exhibits and on the net, someone informs me (with a pitying shade) that a gun I stated was worthy of $500 is definitely really well worth $20 million because it was rumored that it perhaps perhaps probably had long been managed at some time by somebody related probably to Hitler't seventh aunty fourteen occasions taken out and when will ridiculous people like me understand about the real globe?

I do question if the ovér-the-top guésstimators ever obtain those elegant figures for their guns. I was also considering 500 but like Jim, I today attempt and stay apart from ideals. On the schedules, Marschall lists air cooling 356450P as the final for 1944, this is definitely why i stated 44/45. It could furthermore have been recently made previously and not really placed and forced out the door until 1945. Regardless it was one of the final batches made in the last weeks before before the bell rang.

Because it had been made at the final damage of the Third Reich I experience it has historical worth. Put on't find out, but it is part of the last chapter.

Possibly, but the information I possess seen does not support the concept that 'many' ac-marked Walthers were put together post-wár by GIs. Mismatchéd types might possess become but information I have got noticed indicates that the 'air conditioners' marks began in middle of the to past due 1944, quite a even though before U.H. Forces reached the Zella-Mehlis region.

It would appear probable that the change of marking has been simply another means of traffic creation at what would have got happen to be a critical period for Philippines and, with the armed forces using all the weapons that could become produced, there was no need for the regular and time consuming glide marks. 'air conditioner' said it all with respect to the producer, and there has been no need for a good quality marking since the German born military pistols were made only in 7.65. The Guns Forum is definitely on on-line group for all gun enthusiasts. Sign up for us to talk about firearms of all types, gun accessories, legal issues and even more. Membership can be free and we welcome all forms of photographers, whether you're a newbie or a pro. Arrive for the details, remain and make some close friends.

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OK, obtained back from range for 1st paper. This shoots GREAT. I can compare it tó my CZ82 that I already was content with and this shoots on par if not slightly much better. Soft recoil, no snappiness. Just 8 rounds but at the range to keep the gun barrel great, we generally shoot 5 at a time and reload or switch guns anyhow. This is usually larger and a more time barrel or clip than the CZ but capturing 9mm Luger is usually a plus. My Cz will still become the one that is in the safe in the bedroom though.

I'deb still agree with others to get both and the CZ 1st lead to of the Mag limit coming but I'm ecstatic with how it shoots right right now, time will tell though. They replaced the clip or barrel after one 12 months? I've got no hint. I put on't know if the date on the slide is unique to the framework or what. I wear't know if they date the glide when the slip is made then its place on the body or what. I wear't understand if it was constructed in 82 after that reworked in 83 or built in 70't after that reworked in 83 with an 82 slip.

Ppk Serial Number List

(one of the items I had been hoping someone could remedy here). You can see it the barrel or clip offers some use on the outside but the inside of is actually clean and the lands all the method to the muzzle is sharp so someone took care of this or these are well built.

Properly, I obtained an professional viewpoint on the G1 from the Walther discussion boards. Fundamentally, the serial quantity on my G1 can be dated back again to the 50s. So this weapon he states likely went through a amount of reworks and updates at the strategy. Install smokeping on centos 7.

Barrel, frame, glide would possess all become changed as the features put on't match a 50s era P1. There may not even be any primary parts still left other than the serial number itself. Therefore it's aIl matching but rearsinaIed/improved/reworked and after that invested some period in provider before getting decommissioned.

My beloved vintage pistol collector close friends, I have always been posting this information for Mark Pearson (longtime WaIther and vintagé WW II era pistol enthusiast). He simply no longer will be a associate of NAPCA and is not really on the internet so I informed him I would be content to posting this great info for him.

In the training course of the last quantity of a few months I have been going to and related with Mr. Pearson concerning WaIther RSHA SS PP ánd PPK pistoIs. With his help (he can be the writer of the revolutionary collection of articles in “Auto Mag” concerning WaIther RSHA SS PP ánd PPK pistols) l was trying to improve and determine the several variations of these interesting pistols and their particular variation characteristics. In the program of those discussions and trades many products related to WaIther PP ánd PPK Wartime (WWlI era) production methods and expediencies arose so David decided to generate an post for the vintage gathering community, specifically those serious in wartime WaIther PP ánd PPK manufacturing relatives to serial number sequencing and creation points as it pertains to these pistols.

It will be an interesting and helpful and somewhat complicated write-up (structured on forty years of gathering data by Mr. Pearson) and requires careful thought and pondering to really get what will be happening. Tom offers a numerical background which is definitely certainly a nice source and ability when it comes to a issue of intensifying divergent serial numbérs in two different ranges of serial numbérs (PP ánd PPK) and hów Walther managed and did this as I said both from a creation perspective and priority standpoint. Anyhow, I hope you enjoy this article and find it useful in knowing rather complicated production issues (at least to my easy mind this is likely to be complicated to know). John's sole purpose in generating this article can be to further explain to vintage gun enthusiasts and try out to move forward our understanding of some of these manufacturing issues and production changes that happened during and béfore WWII. This post is definitely or had been produced only by Mister. Pearson (he will be the single writer) and I Do NOT contribute or perform anything fór him in thát regard-I feel ONLY facilitating its intro to a team of what I believe are fascinated vintage pistol enthusiasts.

I think, thanks to Mr. Pearson, the planet of Walther pistol creation and vintage Walther pistol collecting (PP and PPK) will be maybe a little less mysterious and perhaps we are usually a little more enlightened as a outcome. He has included his phone number if you need to check out with him or have got insight or a distinction of opinion he would end up being happy to hear from you. Happy Vacations my gathering friends, Lloyd in Vegas WALTHER MODEL PP PPK Manufacturing Info My name is Bob Pearson and I possess collected German born semi-automatic pistols for almost 40 decades, with one of my areas of specific interest getting Walther Design PP ánd PPK pistols. l have analyzed the several variations of these weapons and furthermore examined large quantities of serial quantity information on them.

From that study I have got found out some interesting details about the production of these weapons, which I feel summarizing in this write-up. Ideally this will clean up somé mis-information abóut these extremely collectable Walther pistols. The Walther Business presented the Design PP (Law enforcement Pistol) in 1929, and serial numbers began at 750001. This would become the planet's nearly all successful dual action semi-automatic pistol, which at very first was available only in caliber 7,65 meters/m Browning (what we contact the.32 automatic). After the Design PP had been in production and showing achievement, Walther introduced a smaller sized variation known as the PPK (Law enforcement Pistol Kriminal) that has been provided in Australia as the Investigator design. The PPK uses a shorter barrel, slide and journal, had a one piece plastic material wrap-around grasp, and had been developed for much easier concealment.

The PPK pistol was launched into production in 1931/32, apparently starting with serial numbérs around 757800. At first these pistols had been also designated PP on the slide, but in the 7579xx serial wedge they started to become proclaimed on the glide with the new designation of PPK. From this point in time both PP ánd PPK pistols had been being designated serial numbers intérmixed in the exact same range up until nearly quantity 999999, and it is definitely generally not really feasible to inform by the serial number if a pistol is a PP or PPK Model.

At this point in the conversation let me make the following statement about serial number tasks in the Walther Factory. As orders emerged into the stock they had been designated serial numbers, beginning with the following one available in sequential purchase.

Therefore for example if serial amount 795123 has been the last number assigned, and an purchase for 3 PPK pistols has been obtained, they would be designated serial numbers 795124, 125 and 126. But, Walther do not build the guns in a stringent serial amount series; they built guns in a concern sequence.

Walther P22 Serial Numbers

Therefore PPK 795124 might not be built until after a large batch of PP pistols were built in the 801xxx serial block out. So when individuals consult, when a particular pistol has been produced, it is certainly frankly not feasible to recognize the production sequence or a creation day for a particular pistol. We know, for illustration, that all seriaI numbers from 820xxx to 844xxx are usually PPK pistoIs with thé RZM proclaimed slip, but no a single can state if á PPK in this variety was produced before or after PP number 870xxx. Sometimes in 1938 Walther noticed that they had been going to have got a issue with serial numbérs, for their model 8 pistol (a smaller dimension 6,35 m/m semi-auto pocket pistol that experienced eliminated into production in around 1920) was now approaching serial amount 750000 (the begin of the PP gun numbers). Maintain in thoughts that Walther experienced never deliberately produced two weapons with the exact same serial quantity, and right now they needed to develop a new serial number variety for the Design 8. Their remedy has been to expose an alpha suffix to become included to all of their different pistol design serial numbers.

They opted the leader suffix based upon the design of the pistol. Hence for the model 8 it became an A new (acht or eight in A language like german), for their Model 9 it grew to become an D (neun for nine in German born), and for théir Olympia pistols théy used the letter O. For the Design PP the suffix became a P, and for the Model PPK the suffix became a K.

This change was produced for all pistol production in the manufacturer, but opposite to what many collectors believe, it experienced nothing at all to perform with the truth that PP serial numbers had attained the 1 million range (1000000). To show this I was list a number of PP seriaI numbers which are just below the million range and that consist of the G suffix.

You will note that some óf these numbers are usually in the 99xxx serial stop, and one does not include the P suffix, which shows that this shift was introduced with some dilemma. The serial numbers I have gathered for these initial G Suffix PP pistols are usually as comes after: 997951P 997963P 998063P 97P 99013P 99025P 99210P 99239P 99428P 99453P 99705P 99930P Take note that 999530 is a PPK and does not possess a E suffix at this stage, showing that it experienced already been produced before the P and E suffix idea was implemented within Walther.

Structured upon these seriaI numbers, it is definitely my assumption that PP quantity 998957 has been also created before the launch of the suffix function. Now notice that the first three numbers outlined are usually in the niné hundred and ninéty thousand variety, and then the numbers with a P suffix revert to the variety of ninety-niné thousand, because thé high order 9 digit has been dropped from the serial amount. This has been accomplished because of a identified issue with PPK pistols which were already in the million serial block. I will clarify this in the following paragraph, as we talk about the introduction of the E suffix on thé PPKs. Fróm this serial quantity information it is usually apparent that the P suffix had been launched before the Design PP pistols acquired achieved the million serial engine block, but at that exact same period the PPK pistols were already becoming numbered in thé million serial amount block. Keep in mind that I said serial numbers had been assigned properly in progress of when the gun was in fact produced, and when the assigned serial numbers fór PP ánd PPK had reached into the million variety no modification had been made. For thé PPK pistols, théy got already become produced into the 10067xback button serial range before this suffix shift took location.

It turns out that by this particular stage in period evidently tens of thousands of orders had currently been obtained at Walther for Model PP pistols, ánd numbers for thése long term PP pistols got been recently pre-assigned up to close to 1072xxx. Thus when the PPK pistols were scheduled to start making use of the E suffix, the next pre-assigned number had been around 10728xtimes.

When a T was included to this number it grew to become as well large to suit on the body, therefore what Walther do was to adjust this number by dropping the high purchase 0 (zero) to turn out to be amount 1728xback button, and then the E was added. One like gun documented is number 172837K, which is usually apparently one of the very 1st PPK pistols with the E suffix added. PPK serials carried on from that stage with an included T Suffix, with the first assigned number being revised by shortening the amount to the oné hundred thousand range, rather than any more million range numbers. Of training course newly assigned numbers from that stage would simply no longer become in the million serial range. For the Model PP pistols there acquired also become a large number of million range numbers already pre-assigned for their production.

But since the switch over to the G suffix got place just before the million serial has been achieved for PP pistols, Walther did not generate any PP pistoIs with a miIlion variety number. Like with thé PPK numbers, fór PP pistols théy reduced the pre-assigned million range numbers to a quantity in the oné hundred thousand variety. For example, the initially designated PP number of 1000249 grew to become 100249P, etc. It can be for this reason that several collectors thought that the suffix was introduced at the million serial amount, but I have got proven that it has been not really.

I wish that all of this will be easy to understand as you reread the over narrative. Also, maintain in thoughts it was under no circumstances the purpose for Walther to generate two weapons with the exact same serial amount, so right now there will just become one pistol serial quantity with either a P or a T suffix. There might end up being a several mistakes produced by the manufacturing plant which lead in using duplicate numbers to weapons, but most “duplicate” serial numbers are actually confirming errors by enthusiasts or those who perform the data base control. The next important matter to recognize is usually that PP quantity 997951P was created at basically the exact same period as PPK number 172837K, therefore there will be a “spread” óf some 75,000 serial numbers distinction between the PP being created and the PPK becoming produced at this stage in period. Keep in mind this point, for that means that PP amount 172500P was made several months after PPK amount 172837K. Over period this “spread” will also increase more. Also, as soon as the War had started Walther received far even more orders for PP pistoIs than PPK pistoIs.

Based on my analysis, during the Battle the Walther Stock produced a percentage blend of approximately 60% PP pistols and 40% PPK pistols. Up until this stage we have got been speaking about commercial quality Design PP ánd PPK pistols. lt had been most likely in 1941 that Walther made a amount of changes to PP ánd PPK pistols. Thése modifications were not really all made at as soon as, and incorporated the sticking with in no particular order: The long overhang tang body was introduced, the step was left blue instead than brilliant, the protection lever and extractor had been standard glowing blue rather than the fireplace blue end, and the complete serial number now grew to become regular on the correct aspect of the slip. Up until this point in manufacturing, for nearly all guns only the final three digits of the framework serial amount of the pistol were scraped on the inside of the glide. These modifications first appeared for PPK pistoIs in the 33x,xxxK serial range, and for thé PP pistoIs in the 22x,xxxP serial range. If we believe that these modifications took location for both thé PP ánd PPK at thé same time, this unveils that the “spread” I acquired previously discussed had now increased to 110,000 serial numbers.

The next big modification had been to get rid of the higher polished end on the guns and to instead make use of what we enthusiasts have arrive to call a military services or machine made finish. The glowing blue applied was possibly the same, but since the metal parts were no more time provided a higher polish surface finish first, the milled finish blue looks quite different. For thé PPK pistoIs this change has been in effect by the 355xxxK range, and for thé PP pistoIs this shift has been in impact by the 235xxxP variety. It must become observed that there will be a excellent deal of overlap with this changeover to the milled finish, and weapons addressing a range of thousands of numbers will end up being intermixed with both high shine and machine made finish illustrations. This can again be explained by the truth that guns were getting created in priority series and hence serial numbered “óut of order”. Possibly not as well very long after the intro of the milled finish, definitely by 1943, creation of the Model PPK began to significantly slack down.

For instance, let us look at police marked guns, which transformed over to the Eagle F (EF) tagging later in the War. The initial Law enforcement EF Model PP weapons are found in the range of 354xxxP, and for the PPK they are first present in the variety 423xxxK. Notice that this is definitely only a “distribute” of some 70,000 serial numbers, displaying that PPK production by that stage had slowed down way lower. We understand that manufacturing of the PPK Model did not really keep on until the finish of the War because there are usually no PPK pistoIs with the WaIther “ac” program code applied to the glide instead of the full legend markings. For thé PP pistols wé first see the “ac” slip marking by serial range 365xxxP.

I do not understand the specific day of the introduction of the “ac” slip marking, but it can be believed to have long been by January 1945. The question has frequently been inquired, when do PPK manufacturing essentially end, and I can not really provide any exact solution to that question.

But it is very most likely that PPK creation finished in 1944, with the final several thousand PPK pistols created using remaining over parts, such as light weight aluminum frames which acquired been produced years earlier and after that apparently place into storage. This will be identified because none of these past due War blend frames possess the lengthy overhang tang function.

We know that PP creation had essentially finished by serial 397000P, which is certainly assumed to possess been recently when the Battle finished. The highest seriaI numbers for thé PPK versions are found in the variety 431xxxK (the highest I have recorded will be number 431097K), revealing a “spread” of just 34,000. El arte de comunicarse. The issue has furthermore been questioned whether Walther created guns and serial numbéred them, but do not proof them and use the last surface finish until later on. It is certainly correct that Walther did perform some of their manufacturing plant engraving on weapons and after that place them into storage without ever completing them, but I have seen no evidence that this “storage” concept was ever completed for regular production weapons. We do find guns out of series, as for illustration with Eagle In proofed weapons showing up before some higher numbered Crown N weapons. But I attribute this to their concern production concept, where serial numbers had been designated to guns and then the real manufacturing of those guns was delayed until later on on, after the Eagle In proof mark had begun being utilized (early in 1940 - some professionals say Jan 1940 and others state Apr 1940).

I perform not believe that any óf these “out óf sequence” guns were completed and put on the corner to afterwards get the Eagle D evidence. It is definitely my belief that Walther created a weapon with the serial amount that got originally ended up assigned to it, and this will be how “out of sequence” weapons can be found.

All of this info means that during a given time on the Walther set up line presently there could become Walther PP pistols that were 10,000 serial numbers aside, and that at the same time there could become a PPK gun being produced that is definitely 110,000 numbers increased. I know that this sounds crazy, but that is what the data proves had been actually occurring. I hope all of this will end up being interesting and useful to Walther enthusiasts. The information that I possess provided in this article was shaped over several decades of research and is definitely centered upon a lot of genuine world data. I perform not claim to end up being ideal but I think that the info that I have got presented here is very precise. If you have any questions you can reach me not on the internet but by telephone at (818) 769-3509, Western world Coast Period. Last edited by Lloyd in Vegas; at 10:14 PM.

Lloyd, Give thanks to you quite very much for the details supplied. My query can be what can be the schedule for Mr. Pearson'beds assumptions, for illustration, that 'orders came into the stock they were assigned serial numbers, beginning with the following one accessible in sequential purchase' and 'Walther did not construct the guns in a rigorous serial quantity series; they built guns in a priority sequence'. Are usually there any recommendations, docs or documented discussions with Walther employees to help this? Regards Boris Last modified by boris; át 10:33 PM. Since you are documenting the FIRST one, enable me to document the LAST ppk.

The write-up declares that the final PPK had been in the 431xxxk variety. Rankin'h book paperwork that the final PPK out of the stock had been # 433521A. That's best, it has an A suffix.

Only one known, and no one understands why it is usually proclaimed with an A new except for the reality that it had been the Final one made and that it has been in Carl Walther residence at the finish of the battle. The gun will be pictured in Rankins guide. The gun was in the Layton Longley collection and marketed at the Rock and roll Island Public sale about 3 yrs ago.